Wednesday, April 12, 2006

That's Not How It Is In My Book.

How do you raise a child who knows instinctively when to tell the truth, and when to lie. Do you drum into him the values of telling the truth, citing Qur'an and Hadith so he can see better that liars go straight down to hell to be consumed by the fire.

How do you tell him that it is okay to lie under certain circumstances like if he sees mommy or daddy making out with someone else in bed, he should keep quiet about it. Don't tell anyone. Especially mommy, or your daddy, since by doing that mommy and daddy will run to a downtown office to be the first in line to file a divorce.

How do you raise a child like that?

There must be somekind of Hadith to guide you to carry out this mission as parents effectively.

9 Comments:

Blogger Sayuti said...

sir,

eventually the child will learn as he grow up.

i remember when i was four or five yrs old, my sister told me that those who lie will get their tongue cut in the hereafter. i never lie since then.

at least not until i learn about how to manipulate the truth. "i'm not lying, i'm telling the truth, but not all of it."

hehe

you pose a very tough question there, sir.

i cannot answer that question just yet. let me start reading the book my wife gave me a couple of month back, 'mendidik anak menurut islam' first, then i may have a clue to answer that.

however, from what i heard, effective parenting start even before marriage - finding the right person to be the father or the mother of your child.

thats all i can say for now.

p/s: error in my last comment: "can be held liable" should be "cant be held liable". sorry for the mistake.

5:43 PM  
Blogger Nazrah said...

master bergen,

frankly, i felt that these exclusions could be viewed as loopholes in our religion that could potentially incriminate us as an ummah.

in my heart i know, there is no good that can come out of deception. i am sure al-tekeyya is not lying per se.

am pretty sure our religion has an explanation about everything and more often than not the answer is within ourselves, when we receive hidayah.furthermore, in our pursuit to ilmu we need ulama to help enlighten us.


one thing for sure, lying is not a license for one to wriggle oneself out of trouble or to avoid shame, after having done something wrong.

lying to avoid divorce is a big piece of mystery to analyse. but sugarcoating your words to amuse your already healthy relationship with your spouse is alright.don't think it's reasonably permissible cover of deviant behavior.

there may be no specific hadith addressing this issue(we'll look for it ok), the submission to what is permissible is subject to our conviction to what we solemnly believe as the truth.

am pretty sure there are better suited examples to illustrate the exclusions.

in war for example, how could it be condoned if it involves deception and betrayal? an army can fall apart if no one is to be trusted. let's all look for the sub-clauses(any scholars here that can help us out please?).if false testimony, deception and pretense is part of war tactics for us Moslems, what kind of ideas are we propogating about our religion, and the people who embrace it, majority of whom do not go to war to begin with?

as with bearing witness to adultery, one should not keep quiet about it, and risk subahat, even if it's your parents you are talking about. the 3 exclusions are just tips of the iceberg.a little bit like the issue of polygamy. yeah so what if the men can marry 4, but does he know what he is in for? does he qualify?

inculcating good values to ur children, for me, is pretty much like grappling in the dark playing by ear. general rule for me as a parent,is that lying is BAD, BAD, BAD!!! Nothing good can come out of this.That's what I think.That's what I have learnt.

i have lied before, it is still hard to make up for it.people forgive u, but can u forgive urself for that lapse in judgement.

I am resolved to get to the bottom of this. You have brought up something I wish to seek answers to. Will be back to bounce ideas.

5:58 PM  
Blogger Sayuti said...

please do so madam. thank you in advance.

7:00 PM  
Blogger BLaCkFeLiNe said...

Hi Bergen..first and foremost, lying is wrong. There is no 'oke' lie and a not 'oke' lie..
we have first to disipline ourselves to do things properly so that the child do not see our 'wrong' doings, at least not in our own homes.
to tell a lil child that lying will get him burnt in Hell one day and then, to cover our misdeeds, we tell the same child that it's oke to lie so that WE, ourselves dun get 'burnt'would be so confusing would'nt it?

I remember as a child, my dad used to punish me for the slightest lie I told and yet I had to cover his tail whenever he gives a lift to a pretty nurse in his car.
I was his so called 'alibi' coz he would pick up that nurse before sending me to school.
I could not look my mom in the eye after that.. even tho' at that age I didn't know what was going on.

I grew up lying coz I found out that only telling lies would let me get away with the things I want..even my dad bought my lies!

I hate lies and liars now..coz I know there's no reward for lying..

7:59 PM  
Blogger Ms.B said...

The string of comments and points of view from you, Sayuti and Nazrah have been most insightful and thought-provoking. It does show up one glaring fact in all of us, though (more so in some others, like me!) .. that we most certainly don't know enough and that we should strive so much more in order to know ourselves, our faith, our values, and how to live our lives.

I suppose we should always go on the basis that we teach our children the best of everything, which includes that thou shall not lie, not under any circumstances whatsoever. But once they have grown up and can think for themselves, there is not much we can do except to hope and pray that our child will live their lives as the best possible Muslims and human beings. Situational hazards such as whether one should tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth in a particular or all situation(s) is something that only he or she can determine for himself or herself, based on what they have learnt and know, is right and wrong. If I may say so, of course no one in his or her right mind would want to teach one's child about when to and when not to lie. That should not even be remotely contemplated, as we should teach our children all that is good, and hope that they are able to carry that throughout their lives.

But being human, we WILL err, and some may err more than others (me included!!) - even on verity. But we learn, and the goal is to strive to never commit it again, and/or to stay far away from circumstances in which we may be putting ourselves in the face of being untruthful, or where we may have no option but to tell the truth but with a heavy heart - as we know the magnitude of the situation.

I wish I could say more, but my knowledge on this matter is scratchy, and is based merely on what I have experienced in my own life. The ignorant should stay silent and learn, and so I shall sit back, absorb and contemplate whatever it is that your goodselves and the others have to say on this matter. Insha'Allah, all of us will come away from this all the wiser.

Count Byron? Your presence and wisdom is greatly sought in this matter! :)

8:16 PM  
Blogger maklang said...

Present.:)

8:46 AM  
Blogger Restless said...

Heheh (to Mak Lang)

Present too.

9:45 AM  
Blogger Sayuti said...

sorry to learn about your childhood life, ms blackfeline.

mdm blabs, what you write is very much valid. but i dont agree with your second last paragraph. the ignorant (read: people who dont know much) should not just stay silent. they have to ask question. give feedback. else, they dont know what is it that they dont know.

sir bergen,

i had an idea about raising a child, while trying to make one last nite.

hehe

teach the child the 'why' instead of the 'what' of everything. and let the child do the thinking.

imposing fear is a good way to control a child behavior. (child psychologist may not agree to this remark) but, the fear must be based on something which is valid.

fear to God for instant. not fear to ghost, or punishment, or etc. anything else.

tq

p/s: dont worry sir. i dont take any offense on your previous entries. :)

7:05 PM  
Blogger torts said...

My beloved late grandma used to tell kisah relating to morale and good values in islam. I grew up so full of the stories. Lying is a no-no; and the practice has been kalau betul - one should stand for it and kalau salah one should not deny it - however difficult it could be. The rules apply to everyone - and not adjustable to one's convenience. We need to guide & prepare our kids to have the 'right' conscience.

8:32 AM  

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